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  1. #11
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Pinedale, WY
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    19,898
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    Default Re: Casting critique request

    Quote Originally Posted by bazzer69 View Post
    Were are you? I’m a FFI casting instructor and I live in Redding Northern California, if you are nearby I can give you a ( free ) casting lesson. That’s good for anyone else as well. Just PM me with your email address
    Thanks
    Bazza


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Bazza: That is a very generous offer, if I was closer I'd take you up on it. I don't want to sidetrack this thread, but when you said you live in Redding, CA I just have to ask how did you fare in that huge wildfire?
    Larry


  2. #12

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    Quote Originally Posted by bazzer69 View Post
    Were are you? I’m a FFI casting instructor and I live in Redding Northern California, if you are nearby I can give you a ( free ) casting lesson. That’s good for anyone else as well. Just PM me with your email address
    Thanks
    Bazza
    I don't know if the location of the poster shows up in your browser page, but I can see that the OP's location is Golden, Co. I see location at the upper right of the post header with the join date and # of posts.

    I notice that your location does not show. Did you fill your location in your personal page?
    Regards,

    Silver



    "Discovery consists of seeing what everybody has seen and thinking what nobody has thought"..........Szent-Gyorgy

  3. Default Re: Casting critique request

    Quote Originally Posted by silver creek View Post
    I don't know if the location of the poster shows up in your browser page, but I can see that the OP's location is Golden, Co. I see location at the upper right of the post header with the join date and # of posts.

    I notice that your location does not show. Did you fill your location in your personal page?
    Er, I thought my post says exactly where I am! But I’ll update my profile when possible. Casting critique request


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  4. #14
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Golden, CO
    Posts
    1,016

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    Quote Originally Posted by bazzer69 View Post
    Were are you? I’m a FFI casting instructor and I live in Redding Northern California, if you are nearby I can give you a ( free ) casting lesson. That’s good for anyone else as well. Just PM me with your email address
    Thanks
    Bazza


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Thanks for the offer, but I’m in Colorado
    I did find a local FFI instructor though.
    Life is like a box of chocolates...and a river runs through it. Or something like that.

  5. #15
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Golden, CO
    Posts
    1,016

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    Quote Originally Posted by kevind62 View Post

    As once said by a wise man, "there's more than one way to skin a cat". There are more than one way to achieve the long speed stroke with body mechanics. If you're not achieving your goal in your cast you're doing the right thing in asking the question. Just don't get caught up in a cookie cutter fix. One size doesn't fit all. Try several different techniques and/or mix and match to come up with your own. When I was a kid I had two friends who played baseball. Though I never really cared to play the sport on a competitive level (stuck to other fast moving and more aggressive contact sports) I still went to the games to support our team. Both were pitchers. Both through the meanest curveball on the planet for a 17 year old. Both pitches looked exactly the same in flight. Only one difference. One kid through it overhand and the other threw it sidearm. Both achieved the same result.
    I get and agree with your point. I grew up playing baseball and taught golf for a few years (quite a while ago). The parallels in learning the golf swing and the fly cast are many but that’s a different thread.

    With that said I wouldn’t call myself a beginner caster, but maybe I’m trying to take myself back to that point. I did well in the amateur division in the local Golden Games fly fishing competition (a very small local deal) this year, but will be obliged to compete in the “pro” division next year (mostly local guides)

    I’d consider myself competent for the casting required to fish my beloved Colorado streams and Stillwater’s, but improving won’t hurt. With that said, after after watching some of the experts cast in competitions, I know I have work to do as I plan on competing in the Vail mountain games next year. So my real motivation at this point is to get to a level where I can “make the bridge” for anyone who’s familiar.
    Life is like a box of chocolates...and a river runs through it. Or something like that.

  6. #16

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    This is what I see:
    1) your movement is very compact. A bit too compact as your elbow movement is very restricted. The final result is that you are making the ‘windshield’ movement.

    2) your wrist is too firm. To make the final acceleration and to form a good (tight loop is not the holy grail here) loop.

    My advise is:
    3) use a bit more shoulder rotation to support (as in loosen up) your elbow. Let your elbow go down to to your body.

    4) let your wrist support the acceleration by opening up a bit more. Don’t over do it. Hold the wrist after the opening and follow through with your elbow.

  7. #17
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Location
    Golden, CO
    Posts
    1,016

    Default Casting critique request

    Update: been making a few adjustments. Forward cast loop is still not quite as tight as I’d like but I think the primary causes are (in these slomo videos at least)
    1) started the forward cast a bit soon
    2) activated the “active tilt” aka wrist flick on the forward cast a hair too late, and/or still have too much horizontal movement in the elbow/forearm on the forward cast. Brief experimenting after these videos (i.e. after the wife got bored) were taken seems to confirm my theory.

    With that said, my accuracy in the 40-60’ range along with my overall distance has improved dramatically since the last local competition I usually do in May.

    Also, today was the first test run with a new SA MED line and wow, what a difference! The Sage One Elite 5wt I’m using loved that line much more than the Rio Gold I was using before. Close in was about the same but anything over 30’ was much improved with this line.



    Life is like a box of chocolates...and a river runs through it. Or something like that.

  8. #18
    Join Date
    Oct 2007
    Location
    Wasilla / Skwentna, Alaska
    Posts
    16,671
    Blog Entries
    130

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    I'm pretty sure you know that I don't wade into these casting discussions often, there's just to many others who are way better than I am but...………….

    I looked at the second video on the video website where I could get a full screen picture and I have a good monitor. What I see? You need a more crisp sweep into the back cast and a higher stop on the forward.

    You are stopping at what I would call the 11 or 1 O' clock point on your back cast but allowing the rod to drift to horizontal on the forward cast.

    For a tighter loop without using the free hand for line haul / speed, you need crisp strokes and stops because it is only the one arm and rod that are responsible for generating all the energy and line speed.

    If you are going to allow either the fore or back cast to have rod drift you are better off on the back cast. You can get away with more on the back than on the forward cast. That forward cast needs a high abrupt stop to create the tight loop. Once the loop has formed and has unfurled toward the target you can allow some drift toward the horizontal if you wish to shoot additional line into the cast. That's another story though.

    Anywhere can be the land of great expectations, broken dreams, or paradise found, it's all up to you.

    Life On The Line - Alaska Fishing with Ard
    Ard's Forum blog, Alaska Outdoors

  9. Thanks tx_newb thanked for this post
  10. #19
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    south florida
    Posts
    2,187

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    It is hard to tell anything from your video, but you are on the right track for taking one. Fly casting can be boiled down to acceleration, timing and casting arc. If you move your camera back, and take the film from the same perspective (from the side) as you have done, you will be able to see what the rod is doing.

    Granted that the rod will do what the hand and arm are doing; however, it is total conjecture whether the hand and arm are doing what is necessary at the proper TIME without seeing at least a good portion of the rod bending and un-bending.

    A good video does not have to be razor sharp - but does need to give an idea of rod bend. Here are a couple stills grabbed from a video to illustrate what I'm talking about. Though you can't see the line between hand and stripping guide, there would not be a bend in the rod to that degree if there were slack in the line.

    Peter2.jpg

    In the one below, I have started the haul and the rod butt is roughly perpendicular to my body. It is actually acute to the angle of trajectory. The fastest portion of the haul is just ready to start. Draw a line in your mind along the faint fly line through the rod tip and into the cloud above the second coconut tree from the one on the right.

    Peter6.jpg

    The pic below is just about at the peak velocity of the haul and you can clearly see that the line coming out the tip- compared to the previous picture - is very close to the same elevation as the prior picture as compared to the coconut tree in the background. In other words, the line is very taunt and on a trajectory very close to the previous picture. No hump or dip in the line.

    Peter8.jpg

    What the three stills show is the following:

    Pic#1) The timing of the start of the backcast started pulling the line in the direction of the backcast very early in the casting stroke as evidenced by the rod bend compared to the angle of the rod butt.

    Pic#2) The rod bend has increased dramatically from Pic #1, and the line elevation can be noted by it's relation to the coconut tree

    Pic #3) The rod bend increased more from pic #2, yet the line remained very close to the same elevation as in pic #2. This means that the rod tip path was relatively straight relative to the ground (in the plane we can see) for the critical portion of the casting stroke. Therefore, it was most likely an efficient application of power applied at the right time to result in a decent cast.

    From those three pics we can infer that the cast was an efficient one. And that was, indeed, the case. You'll either have to take my word on that or force me to find the actual video.

    Keep at it, and go for some videos showing more of the rod.
    http://www.miterclamp.com/Images/N_Amer_FF.jpg Cheers, Jim

  11. #20
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    Location
    south florida
    Posts
    2,187

    Default Re: Casting critique request

    Ok. I just watched the last two videos by right clicking and copying the vimeo website so I could see it full screen. I agree with Ard. You are not accelerating your backcast which is causing a very open loop back there.

    That creates sag in the line at the start of your forward cast because you have to wait too long before starting it in order for the fly end of the line behind you to straighten (with a big sag in it). While it is true that casting for targets at short distances is easier with a wider loop which will slam the fly down quickly, that can be done more effectively starting from a sag free backcast.

    Regardless of the eventual presentation, when single hand casting, it is nearly always far better to start it off with a backcast that is as straight as possible at the start of the forward cast. The longer it takes the fly to get back there, the longer gravity has to drop all the line between the rod and the fly - regardless of the trajectory of the backcast. Once the line is straight behind you at the start of the forward cast, you can start fresh with whatever loop size or shape or hook you want with the forward cast.

    In other words, you have eliminated half of the variables you have to deal with (ie the estimated amount of sag/slack behind you, and the additional length of time for wind to act upon it).
    http://www.miterclamp.com/Images/N_Amer_FF.jpg Cheers, Jim

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