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  1. #51

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Quote Originally Posted by cooutlaw View Post
    When I first started fly fishing as a teen I fished some really small water (basically anything that held a small trout, some 2 - 8 ' wide)....and I learned quite a bit, as I moved to bigger and bigger water and different States and guided as a young man, I, and clients, were addicted to chasing bigger fish and I spent many years in that pursuit. As I have become older and circled back to smaller water as an often preferred and sought after pastime, I have again found the romance and addiction it offers.
    Cooutlaw,

    We must have been of similar mindset. I would fish any water I could get to as a teenager/young adult. I'd fill up the car and take my old chevy Caviler down dirt roads in the national forest where it had no business going. You don't know "difficult presentation" until you've tried to cast to a 2' wide 2' deep spring creek with high grass on both sides. Pulling 8" brookies out of there was one of the highlights of my life. Sadly, that creek was channelized and put in a culvert in order to make a parking lot. Hopefully it makes the point of what I was speaking of when I spoke of "accuracy" earlier. Being able to hit small targets in difficult situations is paramount. I could have NEVER made the cast with a 9' leader not not mention a 12' or 14' one that some have advocated. Not to say those techniques don't have their time and place, but again everyone as their definition of "small" and at that time, that was mine. If I were a betting man, I would bet that I would have real difficulty making those cast today, ever after all the water under the bridge...

    I have once again circled back to small waters. Part of it is teaching my young son the art of fly fishing. It's a mission of necessity as much as anything. Many of our larger rivers serve as conduits for irrigation flows in the summer and, in my opinion, aren't safe to wade for young anglers. I'm sure it's a similar situation in CO. The good thing is, these waters are perfect training grounds for new anglers. If one finds themselves on these types of waters often, the I would dare say they understand the last line of my sig....
    "Do yourself a favor. Take a kid fishing." - Franc White aka "The Southern Sportsman"

    "Maybe your stature as a fly fisherman isn't determined by how big a trout you can catch but how small a trout you can catch without being disappointed." - John Gierach

    "Many men go fishing all of their lives without knowing that it is not fish they are after." - Henry David Thoreau

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  3. #52
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Location
    Michigan's U.P.
    Posts
    2,600

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    I use Trout LT for my 1, 2, and 3 Wt. rods. https://www.rioproducts.com/products...ch-trout-lt-wf.
    When fishing small overgrown streams, I fish down stream and it seems to work great.

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  5. #53

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    hi,


    for those who wish to dig deeper and deeper it might be worthful to inform about the

    antidrag - casts of the italians(tlt,sms, f.e).

    not easy but very astonishing.


    good luck.


    thomas

  6. #54
    Join Date
    Sep 2016
    Location
    Yorkshire UK a mile or so from the sea and my nearest trout stream
    Posts
    18

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Hi

    I fish that type of water a lot . I fish directly up stream with as long a rod as the tree cover allows . Anything from a 8ft 6 to a 11ft in two to three weights . In Turbulent water like that an approach from downstream should allow short casts . A long rod and light line should allow you to hold of as much fly line of the water . As you will get a drag free drift for no time at all if fly line gets on the water surface . There are a couple of streams like that I fish and I actually use a 12ft Tenkara rod that allows me to drop a biggish dry in the tiniest pockets . As others have said fish in streams like that have a small window of opportunity and takes are pretty much instant or not at all. Small bushy dries dropped into tempting pockets are the way to go.

    Pretty stream that its just the sort of thing I love to fish over in the UK.

    Green Stick

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  8. #55

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Hi guys, I have my 2wt all rigged up and I went with an Airflow Super DRI elite WF2F 36` head 100 grain. I think that is going to fit the bill nice. a little more distance and wind handling can carry bushy humpies and elk hair caddis nicely too.

    Casting this line again today in wind on the grass, it performs well, too windy for any 2 or 3wt still I could cast 40` and I could fish it. I really like this line and I`m going to fish it tomorrow, should be a good BWO and Caddis hatch with the warmer weather lately.

    I am exited to see the dry fly presentation the front taper is nice for a WF line and reading reviews this line floats high with nice mending.

    We will see if I can fool some wise brook trout and browns tomorrow.

    The rod I went with a Redington 276-4 I liked the price point in case I didn't like it and I know I already like my 386-4, I`ll have both rods tomorrow and the 2wt casts 3wt rio gold really well.

    It is very likely If I like this rod to look for an older sage or a dart in the future.

    I`m really excited about the airflow super DRI WF line, front taper looks and presents nice and still delivers distance without a too aggressive front.

  9. #56

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Quote Originally Posted by dr d View Post
    hi,

    for those who wish to dig deeper and deeper it might be worthful to inform about the

    antidrag - casts of the italians(tlt,sms, f.e).

    thomas
    Here are 2 videos of the "Italian Style of Casting."



    In the video above, some of the casts are sidearm constant tension oval casts. Others are overhead and even cross body. It seems to me that the strategy is short accurate floats with the cast unfurling just above the water whether the trajectory is by sidearm or overhead. Hence the light lines that match the leader butt so the long leaders are extension of the fly line allowing the loop formation to the end of the cast.

    I think that you won't get much of a float when the entire leader extends ABOVE the water. I suspect that the strategy in this case is to get a very accurate cast with a reaction strike by simulating a fly landing in the feeding lane of the fish. Notice that there is NO nymphing or a dry dropper which would be very difficult to do with this technique. The tight loop precludes a second trailing fly which would entangle the tight loop.

    Note that the leader does NOT have traditional fixed knots. The knots are interlocked perfection loops so there are loop to loops connections between the leader segments. I suspect that this allows the leader to better adapt to differential currents and allows for a longer drag free float DESPITE the straight line appearance of the cast.

    It seems to me that the way the caster creates slack is both the leader design plus that he casts so that the leader hits the water BEFORE the leader loop unfurls. It is hard to see on this video but I wonder if this delivers slack at the point where the loop hits the water. If this is true, the caster can determining when and how the loop hits the water, he controls the amount of slack at the point of delivery. This is all supposition on my part because I am trying to think of ways that a drag free float can occur with such a straight line cast.

    If Dr D knows how this system works, please post.

    Here is another video in which there are slack line casts.



    There are more videos on the website. Use Google Translate.

    Videos | S.I.M. Suisse
    Regards,

    Silver



    "Discovery consists of seeing what everybody has seen and thinking what nobody has thought"..........Szent-Gyorgy

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  11. #57

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Not something I know much about, ive never met up with anyone proficient in the style... but there are a range of different presentation casts...
    Some more here-

  12. #58

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    hi,


    they are indeed a little bit mysteriously - may be part of tradition and business idea...

    o.k. there we are>>>

    magliocco has one remarcable cast i use:the slowed down angular cast-it serves to circumvent faster currents

    and stack the long leader in the slower water.its really important to aim exactly and tightening the loop - then releasing the line when

    loop is formed>>>result is a stacked leader in the slack water - when youre fit in micromending you can hold a dryfly

    nearby whitewater for a little eternity>>> and then the big ones will often come.

    i takes a longer time to get used to it - honestly its difficult but wonderful to see when it works.


    have great fun.


    thomas

  13. #59

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Hi Guys, I did manage a couple good fish on caddis last time out on a very challenging day, posted a report and pics in the driftless section where I normally do.

    It was partially the line and partiality my casting and presentation.

    Certainly this thread has helped, can't wait for warmer weather and epic hatches soon.


    Very interesting casts on that Italian video, some cool stuff, I don't understand how that straight parallel cast works, it looks like a bullet down to impact, then he hooks up on a fish. lol
    Last edited by unknownflyman; 04-13-2019 at 11:03 PM.

  14. #60
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Truckee, CA.
    Posts
    2,458
    Blog Entries
    2

    Default Re: Improving Dry Fly Presentation

    Quote Originally Posted by unknownflyman View Post
    Interesting conversation starting, I present side to down usually many times I catch the most finicky feeders with a upriver curve cast, sometimes because of the woods there isnt a great angle.

    Some friends Ive fished with have the no splash drag free thing going down on every cast, Im not so fortunate yet. LoL but part of that I feel is the WF line.

    Nothing more maddening than finding a good brown feeding and screwing up that one shot.
    THAT is why I like hunting Browns.....near perfection is needed.
    It forces a fisher to execute on their first try......which is a challenge for any of us.
    I have been playing with a new concept for a few years now.
    Steal the snap part of the snap T, and use it as a sideways roll cast for your dry fly.
    Snap and end with your rod tip high. This will give a soft presentation with less rod movement.
    Snapping for a down stream anchor, or an up stream snap will give you a different anchor.
    Slow water in front of you and fast water where your fly is landing, or fast water near you and slow "over there".
    I have been teaching this to beginners for several years, and it works.
    Those with a drift issue, or splashy cast issues can benefit greatly.............
    I don't want to say I invented a cast after all the casters in the past and present.......but I haven't seen or heard of this approach with a dry fly. Anyway, it works for those spots where the overhand cast will be an issue.
    Unknown, I wish you were closer to my water......I'd give you a perfect drift in short order.

    Jim
    The bar isn't set by the fish we catch, but by the one's we don't.

    Bigfly

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