I was reading the thread below "distance with a 5wt" and thought I'd ask this question in a new thread. I'm casting about 40ft(setting in my lawn chair) with my 5wt Sage SP using Wulf TT (which cast beautifuly i might add) but my fly would wander off the mark as the line settled. There was a light wind blowing but I would like to know if this is common or something us amateurs must learn to overcome. The fly was light and the TT laid out straight but the mono leader wandered away from the line of sight. It seems to me the leader is not laying straight. I run it thru a rubber pad before casting but it still retains some memory. Any Ideas?
Accuracy casting
- Thread starter BigNick
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FrankB2
Well-known member
Hmmm....It could be that the leader is too light or too long. Dropping the
rod tip before the leader straightens completely could cause the line to
lay out straight, but kill the energy transfer to the leader. Try aiming
2-3 feet above the the lawn/water. A 7 1/2 foot 4x leader may help matters
as well. I really like knotted leaders for better turnover.
rod tip before the leader straightens completely could cause the line to
lay out straight, but kill the energy transfer to the leader. Try aiming
2-3 feet above the the lawn/water. A 7 1/2 foot 4x leader may help matters
as well. I really like knotted leaders for better turnover.
Well, I'm bream fishing using subsurface buggers. My leader is just a piece of mono, 6lb, about 5ft long. Yes, I know this is not kosher but hey it's just bream. (am I being too lazy here?) But I do like my accuracy. Like when casting to a stump and I want to place the fly up close so it will fall by the trunk. It may be more wind than anything but I'm guessing here. I don't have much luck using a longer leader, it just goes farther away than I want it too and seems much harder to cast. I don't make long cast as most time I'm in a boat. (hence the lawn chair).
Thanks guys for your input, it is appreciated.
BigNick
Thanks guys for your input, it is appreciated.
BigNick
The leader has alot to do with how the fly turns over, but it sounds to me like it might be more of an enrgy transfer issue, as Frank said. If you are sitting down and casting 40 feet out, you might not be getting that good, tight loop for the leader to turn over straight. And yes, the wind is something that we have to overcome and compensate for.
peregrines
Super Moderator/Fly Swap Coordinator
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Nick,
A guy I fished with could only cast accurately if he stuck his tongue out-- like michael jordan shooting hoops. It was very funny and we all made fun of him, but he caught fish....
It's funny you mentioned sitting while casting, because that eliminates another suggestion. When casting short distances for accuracy i stand right foot forward (same side as casting arm), when going for distance, right foot back in a more open stance. Same principle as darts vs throwing a football.
It may be also that in the final forward cast you dip your rod a little far forward without realizing it, which tends to open up the loop. I have a tendency to do that, and find like FrankB suggested, aiming a little high on the release 2-3 feet over the target helps to keep the loop tight, at least for me.
I think if you're using a weighted bugger, it should have enough oomph to layout with the mono since the leader doesn't seem too long, but an 8' knotless bass leader with a heavy butt might help too, and will help layout the fly. They're built for throwing heavily weighted flies or large wind resistant stuff like poppers to get them to lay out straight instead of doing a "dying Quail" in the air at the end of your cast.
If you want to experiment a bit, try a 3 1/2 to 4' section of 20-25lb mono as a butt for your leader if you have some lying around, with a small perfection loop at the end. Tie a 2 1/2-3 foot section of 6lb as the "tippet" to the small loop with a loop to loop, or directly with an improved clinch. If that seems to help, you might be happy with that set up and call it good, but you may find that going to a furled or bass leader may work even better for you if the heavy mono butt seems to make a difference in getting the fly to layout straight.
I have a 5 SP rod too, it's a real sweet rod. And have been thinking about the TT line to match with it. Glad to hear you like it with the rod.
Mark
A guy I fished with could only cast accurately if he stuck his tongue out-- like michael jordan shooting hoops. It was very funny and we all made fun of him, but he caught fish....
It's funny you mentioned sitting while casting, because that eliminates another suggestion. When casting short distances for accuracy i stand right foot forward (same side as casting arm), when going for distance, right foot back in a more open stance. Same principle as darts vs throwing a football.
It may be also that in the final forward cast you dip your rod a little far forward without realizing it, which tends to open up the loop. I have a tendency to do that, and find like FrankB suggested, aiming a little high on the release 2-3 feet over the target helps to keep the loop tight, at least for me.
I think if you're using a weighted bugger, it should have enough oomph to layout with the mono since the leader doesn't seem too long, but an 8' knotless bass leader with a heavy butt might help too, and will help layout the fly. They're built for throwing heavily weighted flies or large wind resistant stuff like poppers to get them to lay out straight instead of doing a "dying Quail" in the air at the end of your cast.
If you want to experiment a bit, try a 3 1/2 to 4' section of 20-25lb mono as a butt for your leader if you have some lying around, with a small perfection loop at the end. Tie a 2 1/2-3 foot section of 6lb as the "tippet" to the small loop with a loop to loop, or directly with an improved clinch. If that seems to help, you might be happy with that set up and call it good, but you may find that going to a furled or bass leader may work even better for you if the heavy mono butt seems to make a difference in getting the fly to layout straight.
I have a 5 SP rod too, it's a real sweet rod. And have been thinking about the TT line to match with it. Glad to hear you like it with the rod.
Mark
Nick,
I could wax on about various casts that may or may not solve your drift but would be most honest if I said that you should continue to practice until you find what works for you.
When seeking accuracy on the rivers and streams you may find that a faster stroke and a tight loop cast will give a better delivery to your preferred target.
Ard
I could wax on about various casts that may or may not solve your drift but would be most honest if I said that you should continue to practice until you find what works for you.
When seeking accuracy on the rivers and streams you may find that a faster stroke and a tight loop cast will give a better delivery to your preferred target.
Ard
johnwest43
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I would say that you leader is the problem , the 6lb cant take the energy coming from a 40 ft cast. try a couple feet of 15lb then a 6lb tippet.
As for the issue of a longer leader I find that many store bought leaders butt section is too short and to thin. For instance when i fish with my 4wt using a 12 ft leader i use 5 feet of 20lb, then 2ft of 15lb 1 ft of 10lb 1 ft 8lb them my tippet (3ft). Hope this helps.
John
As for the issue of a longer leader I find that many store bought leaders butt section is too short and to thin. For instance when i fish with my 4wt using a 12 ft leader i use 5 feet of 20lb, then 2ft of 15lb 1 ft of 10lb 1 ft 8lb them my tippet (3ft). Hope this helps.
John
BigCliff
Well-known member
Going with a leader with at least 3 different sections or knotless tapered will really help. 4' of butt, 18" of mid-thickness, and 3' of tippet does pretty well. 20#, 12-15#, and 6-8# is a pretty good set up for a 5wt on warmwater.
If that still doesn't help, you might get away from the TT line. Its basically an extremely long front taper, which equals a very delicate turnover. I know there's lots of folks that swear by them, but there's more of us that swear AT them.
If that still doesn't help, you might get away from the TT line. Its basically an extremely long front taper, which equals a very delicate turnover. I know there's lots of folks that swear by them, but there's more of us that swear AT them.
<<and 3" of tippet>>
You've got to be kidding here. You mean to tell me you tie on 3inches of tippet? Man, you must love to tie knots. I'm trying to get away from tying so many knots. I'd rather spend my time fishing.
Oh, and I may not be in the majority here but I love the TT line. It lays out straight and it's so smooth. The problem I have is the leader/tippet just kind of floating out there and going where it takes a notion. I'll take some of the other post advise but tying 3inch of tippet, no thanks.
BigNick
You've got to be kidding here. You mean to tell me you tie on 3inches of tippet? Man, you must love to tie knots. I'm trying to get away from tying so many knots. I'd rather spend my time fishing.
Oh, and I may not be in the majority here but I love the TT line. It lays out straight and it's so smooth. The problem I have is the leader/tippet just kind of floating out there and going where it takes a notion. I'll take some of the other post advise but tying 3inch of tippet, no thanks.
BigNick
BigCliff
Well-known member
3" was definitely a typo. I went back and fixed it.
That TT line's ability to lay it out there super gently may be part of the reason your leader and fly are going different directions. Gentle may not equal power, and the lack of sufficient casting energy may be why the cast is unrolling irregularly. A more powerful turnover would kick that leader and fly over harder and likely more consistently.
Double hauling and tightening your loop also could help with the turnover issues.
That TT line's ability to lay it out there super gently may be part of the reason your leader and fly are going different directions. Gentle may not equal power, and the lack of sufficient casting energy may be why the cast is unrolling irregularly. A more powerful turnover would kick that leader and fly over harder and likely more consistently.
Double hauling and tightening your loop also could help with the turnover issues.