Competing with other sportspeople for carp

[fichy]

My carp flats on tribs of the Hudson are starting to have quite a few bowfishers on them. Not only are many of the large carp ending up as dried skeletons in the weeds, the surviving carp are starting to avoid many areas. Some places I just didn't even bother with in the past 5 years, as they are very sparsely populated now. I spent this past weekend on a recon mission to find some potential new spots. Some will require the kayak to get to before wade fishing. Another spot I fished in the past has been found by eastern European immigrants and is now heavily fished with bait and buckets. This bothers me less than the wasteful bowfishing. Several lakes I've fished east of San Diego encourage their eradication. I caught a bunch of kids chasing them up a shallow creek with baseball bats at one . The carnage was incredible. Is anyone else experiencing this kind of competition where they fish?


Charlie

 

[Guest1]

I don't even have Carp where I live. The reason I am posting though is a question. I used to live in San Diego and Oceanside. Where the heck is the Hudson? The only Hudson I know of is really long way East of San Diego.

 

[brookfieldangler]

I've only ever had one run in with a bowfisherman. He was standing on top of a bridge and shooting carp from there.

Completely pissed me off.

What really pissed me off is the fact that the fish were just tossed on to the shore.

 

[kingofamberley]

I don't even have Carp where I live. The reason I am posting though is a question. I used to live in San Diego and Oceanside. Where the heck is the Hudson? The only Hudson I know of is really long way East of San Diego.

You don't have carp or bluegill?!?!

 

[dpreller]

we have huge bowfishing tournaments around here and i must admit before it became common knowledge that carp were valuable as a fly rod quarry i shot many of them myself. as long as what they are doing is legal i dont know that you have ant real recourse. maybe your fish and game dept will change regs or something if intrest in carp fishing continues to grow but until it helps theyre bottom line with gain or loss in liscense sales that probably will not happen.the bowfishermen purchase fishing liscence to so i doubt it will change. fortunately for me most of the smaller rivers where i carp fish have zero bow fishing pressure and we have tons of bigger tidal rivers with tons of larger carp where they like to shoot.

 

[itchmesir]

You don't have carp or bluegill?!?!

carp are a stocked species... they were often stocked in well populated areas... to be sold at local fish markets... if you know anything about northern minnesota... it's never been a highly populated area... and most lakes and rivers up there were already plentiful with fish... those lakes that weren't were often stocked with brook trout to feed lumberjacks of the era

 

[fichy]

I don't even have Carp where I live. The reason I am posting though is a question. I used to live in San Diego and Oceanside. Where the heck is the Hudson? The only Hudson I know of is really long way East of San Diego.

Dan, they have these odd inventions that look like big birds- you ride in their bellies.:icon_bigg I'm one of those bums that save all their money to travel and fish.
San Diego Bay is a phenomenal fly fishery and the lakes to the east of it are great carp fishing.Some of the pros here probably fish the fly tournament at Henshaw. Weather is phenomenal, I've actually got bonefish and 13 other species and thanks to Southwest and Hotwire, pretty darn cheap. I usually fish under the Coronado Bridge, launching my float tube from Tidelands Park. I've caught carp all over the place. I live near the upper Hudson on the Battenkill River. Most of my carp are in water that's about 33 or covered with ice right now. If I hadn't had to buy a new truck, I'd be carp fishing in warm sunshine in Ca. in a few weeks. Bay in the morning-carp in the afternoon. I go almost every year. That incident I mentioned was at Lake Morena. It's much better known for giant bass.

Charlie

 

[Guest1]

You don't have carp or bluegill?!?!

Nope. No Carp, no Bluegills. We have Pumpkinseed, but they are a small strain. A 2 1/2" Pumpkinseed here is a giant. This applies to just Rainy River and Lake of the Woods.

I have a spot South of me with giant Pumkinseed. I hooked one that I had lipped like a Bass and turned to a buddy I was fishing with and said "Look at the size of this Pumkinseed" He made some comment that involved at least two swear words. We measured and weighed it. Then I tossed it back.

Later I looked up the state and IGFA all tackle record which it would have destroyed both.

OK, thanks fichy, you had me thinking there was a river there I had missed. I should also add that a lot of the lakes there have gigantic Largemouth.

 

[frogg]

I also live on the Hudson (that river on the east coast). I've seen a few sweet places for targeting carp. The only pressure has been friends and myself chuckin' worms from shore while enjoying cold beverages.
I plan on going after them with the flyrod this year. I've been reading up on it lately, here as well as online articles, and YouTube.
I can't wait for open water!!


Chris

 

[fichy]

Frogg, last year I did a job down near Kinderhook and Stockport Creeks. I carp fished in the evenings after work and was impressed with the fishing. I'll be down that way for striper season, too. I shouldn't tell you this, but corn or dough soaked in vanilla extract makes flies very attractive.:icon_bigg And no , I don't, I like the challenge of catching them on flies only. Just a little trick from childhood...


Charlie

 

[charged]

I understand that on a Fly fishing board such as this, I may get some negative interpretations of my character. Please read this post thoroughly before coming to that judgement.

I'm one of the guys who also bowfish for carp, and also tremendously enjoy fly fishing for them. There usually my main target while fly-fishing, and I really do enjoy fly-fishing for them. When I bowfish for them, I personally do not waste them. I have river front property, and compost what I take. Every year I compost the carp I take, and in late fall I spread the compost throughout the yard.

My thoughts are, that I would rather use this natural fertilizer, than some chemical alternative, especially since I live so close to a major waterway. In my area, the asian carp have become a major nuisance, and this what I concentrate my efforts on. I do also take commons, as I also view them as an invasive species. If the DNR asked me to stop, I would agree.

I'm not affiliated with this video, and it does not contain any bowfishing whatsoever, so please view its contents. It just gives an example, of what the bio-mass in my home waters has become. This video shows the the area in which the fox meets the IL river in Ottawa IL, fast forward to the 55 second mark to get an idea where my view points are derived from.

Note: Mute the sound, as there may be some language in this video that is better off not heard.

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4MJQ2bPWgc0]Asian carp Ottawa IL - YouTube[/ame]

I have a piece of land just a few blocks from where this video was shot, and over the years these invasive species have really put a damper on the ability to catch native fish using traditional methods. Do to their overwhelming bio-mass in the river system, they have been choking out many of the other species.

As with any angling practices, I think there is a difference between being responsible, and being Ir-responsible. I do not associate my practices within the 2nd category.

I think a lot of ones opinions, get formed from ones own local eco-system. While traveling Alaska, I saw signs that asked not to return any northern pike back into the waters, as they were deemed an undesirable species. Coming from IL, to me that just sounded weird, if one was caught on that trip I would have cooked it up.

Note: I come to this board to discuss fly fishing, and will not make a practice of straying off that topic of discussion, as I do understand the intentions of this board. I just wanted to respond to this topic, and explain my personnel view points on the topic being discussed.

 

[Guest1]

If that ever happens here I am not going to be using a bow. I am going to be using a semi auto shotgun. A net, and maybe dynamite. That is unacceptable.

 

[charged]

Brookfieldangler, I know your local to me. If you would ever like to get out someday, Id be happy to take you out. We could flyfish the shallows for commons / grass, or go out hunting silvers / bigheads. Either way, I'm confident I can show you spots on the IL where it would be impossible to put even the slightest dent in the population. Each area fished would be completely re-stocked within a few hours.

 

[williamhj]

Yeah those carp are a whole different animal, so to speak. I remember campaigns to try to stop them from entering the Great Lakes. Not sure where that is now, but what a total mess to have those carp spreading. From what I understand they are very tough to catch through normal fishing techniques.

Some videos I've seen show the guys taking the carp that jumped into the boat and throwing them back into the river. I don't understand that.

 

[fichy]

Charged, no problem from me!!!!!!!!! Very well explained, and you are an exemplary sportsman in my book. I bowfished and even speared suckers for garden compost when I was a kid. In Lake Champlain, Vermont has a pike shooting season. During the spawn , when the pike are up in the grass and bushes, you can shoot them. NY did away with theirs.

Charlie

 

[theboz]

Nope. No Carp, no Bluegills. We have Pumpkinseed, but they are a small strain. A 2 1/2" Pumpkinseed here is a giant. This applies to just Rainy River and Lake of the Woods.

I have a spot South of me with giant Pumkinseed. I hooked one that I had lipped like a Bass and turned to a buddy I was fishing with and said "Look at the size of this Pumkinseed" He made some comment that involved at least two swear words. We measured and weighed it. Then I tossed it back.

Later I looked up the state and IGFA all tackle record which it would have destroyed both.

OK, thanks fichy, you had me thinking there was a river there I had missed. I should also add that a lot of the lakes there have gigantic Largemouth.

Im glad you didnt destroy that record! My son had got it at 6years old and held it for 6 years at 1lb 3oz and it was his pride and joy to brag about as a little kid! Then a girl broke it by 3ozs but he was old enough to take the heat! Haha!

 

[charged]

Yeah those carp are a whole different animal, so to speak. I remember campaigns to try to stop them from entering the Great Lakes. Not sure where that is now, but what a total mess to have those carp spreading. From what I understand they are very tough to catch through normal fishing techniques.

I first purchased the property about 4 1/2 years ago, this next summer will be the fifth. After the initial purchase, I spent a few weeks fishing traditional methods, but constantly saw these 2-3 foot fish swimming past. At first I had no idea what they were.

After some investigation, I educated myself. I went out and purchased a bow mostly out of curiosity. The very first fish I shot, got me into a local area magazine, and also on the DNR's website. That pic still remains to this day.

Asian carp, really can not be targeted using traditional methods, They are filter feeders, and can only be harvested via bow / spear / and in IL, even pitchforks are legal. (this just shows how much our DNR supports there eradication). Anyways this is how I first got involved. Every single year since there seems to be more, and they also get larger.

 

[Guest1]

Im glad you didnt destroy that record! My son had got it at 6years old and held it for 6 years at 1lb 3oz and it was his pride and joy to brag about as a little kid! Then a girl broke it by 3ozs but he was old enough to take the heat! Haha!

It would have slaughtered the 1 lb. 6 oz one as well. I still kick myself over that one. I do feel better knowing a kid got to keep the record. That takes some of the sting out of it.

 

[theboz]

Of all the great fish him and i have caught together he still talks about that big Pumpkinseed! Like the lake you know the lake where this one came from is loaded with slobs! And nobody fishs for them , all concentrating on bass.And the coolest thing is its a real tanic lake and the Pumps are almost black so the other colors show uo so beautiful on their head!Guess we will have to make a trip to see if they are still there.

 

[john montana]

For the record, I am a pretty serious carp nut. They are basically all I fish for anymore. My take on this is pretty simple.

1). It isn't fishing. With a bow, you are in no way attempting to fool a fish with artificial feathers or bait into voluntarily ingesting your hook. It simpy is not fishing, but that doesn't make it wrong.

2). In most places, reasonable harvest of common carp makes sense and will likely improve the over all fishery. But the key word for me is HARVEST. Note, not slaughter. If you are finding a use for the fish (compost works for me, crab bait out here, food etc) and are reasonable in how many you kill, I wouldn't take issue. Carp are a resource much like the rest of our gamefish, and a reasonable and sustainable harvest of that resource makes sense. We aren't talking about golden trout in the Sierra here.

That said, wanton killing is t my bag, nor would I consider such acts the action of a sportsman. I am frequently disgusted by all of the bow killed carp I find left to rot. Be a sportsman. Take your kill and use it. It seems awfully simple to me.

It sounds like the forum members that do kill carp with bows are practicing sportsman, which is great.