The Carp Thread

[enolaeagle]

I'm intrigued with the new carp phenomenom... I see a lot of separate threads on different sub topics like trips, flies etc... The flies look amazing and simple to produce but i'd like to learn more about this so maybe some of you can weigh in here

Here's the kinds of stuff i'd like to know:
*When to fish (night, day or any specific conditions better than others)
*Do you throw your fly and leave it sit like live bait or do you hunt them down and throw it at their nose?
*Has anyone used tandem rigs?
*Should you lightly jig your fly around?
*When making flies, should you use a heavy beadhead eye to flip the hook up? (Id assume weed guards don't matter in this case...)
*Any other fly pattern than grassy stuff that can be effective?

I guess theirs tons of other questions or info that others may want to know like specific equipment.

There's a lot of carp around here in the Susquehanna River. I've seen plenty of people catch them with corn on a hook and at night people will bow fish with a spot light from the boat... I don't know if they're grass carp but interested in giving this a shot.

Any info, pictures, tips are very much appreciated. I've thought of trying a triple tandem rig with a grassy fly then 2 additional flies that look like corn (yellow salmon egg type thingy...)

---------- Post added at 08:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:12 PM ----------

I'm also interested to know hook size for patterns and fly line type that works best (sink tip, full sink or if a floating line will suffice)

 

[Ard]

Todd,

If you want to get on the carp thing contact Mike O'Brien, he's from near you. Google him Mike O'Brien Carp Guide and you'll find him. Tell him Ard Stetts sent you. Mike has been fly fishing carp and guiding for them since the 1970's, he's good at it.

He lives up near Hughesville I think but may have moved by now, look him up and he'll make you a carp master in one trip. Aw, what the heck, here's his page; Mike O'Brien fly fishing

Ard

 

[enolaeagle]

Thanks Ard.

Doesn't cost me extra to stay in that area since my fifth wheel is in Milton area. I'll call him soon for rates.

In the meantime, I'd still like to learn a little bit here from anyone willing to spill the beans:surprise:

 

[Joni]

I'm intrigued with the new carp phenomenom... I see a lot of separate threads on different sub topics like trips, flies etc... The flies look amazing and simple to produce but i'd like to learn more about this so maybe some of you can weigh in here

Here's the kinds of stuff i'd like to know:
*When to fish (night, day or any specific conditions better than others)
*Do you throw your fly and leave it sit like live bait or do you hunt them down and throw it at their nose?
*Has anyone used tandem rigs?
*Should you lightly jig your fly around?
*When making flies, should you use a heavy beadhead eye to flip the hook up? (Id assume weed guards don't matter in this case...)
*Any other fly pattern than grassy stuff that can be effective?

I guess theirs tons of other questions or info that others may want to know like specific equipment.

There's a lot of carp around here in the Susquehanna River. I've seen plenty of people catch them with corn on a hook and at night people will bow fish with a spot light from the boat... I don't know if they're grass carp but interested in giving this a shot.

Any info, pictures, tips are very much appreciated. I've thought of trying a triple tandem rig with a grassy fly then 2 additional flies that look like corn (yellow salmon egg type thingy...)

---------- Post added at 08:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:12 PM ----------

I'm also interested to know hook size for patterns and fly line type that works best (sink tip, full sink or if a floating line will suffice)

I will share my experience.
1. any time during the day, but in the days lately, earlier is better.
2. I have caught them with a fly under a Thingamabobber when the water is too stained to see them. But, when I can see them. I cast in front or to the front side of them and strip the fly slowly in front of them.
3. I have used a Tandem rig, but not as productive. Caught a couple on one.
4. Yes I will jig the fly, or a little movement, but I use only a few different patterns. A yellow softhackle glow bug has been the best. An olive or a black Gartside Gurgler, Elk Hare Caddis, & Hex. I have also caught them on other patterns but these are the ones I make sure I have. I have also great luck with a Midnight Fire bugger on a Type II line.
The only one that is weighted is the Hex with small dumbbell eyes and it floats hook up, but with the weeds it really doesn't help much other than it can get through the weeds to the Carp.
Yellow is my favorite color for Carp.
This is my style and it works great for me.

 

[nick k]

Weighted or unweighted depends on your location. The carp around me don't eat anything unless its on the bottom.

 

[Joni]

Bummer...LOL For me they take it bottom, and top. The glow bug is definitely bottom as is the Hex and Buggers. But today, it was top. They hit the Gurgler, with a few off the glow bug. With all the rain, the water was terribly stained so I used the Gurgler as an indicator.

 

[enolaeagle]

They pretty much suck the bottom here. I've been looking at some leech patterns, woolly buggers etc...

 

[john montana]

My carp eat clams...they rarely feed off the bottom unless there are berries in the water. The biggest thing is knowing their forage so you can find the right visual trigger and make the fly behave properly. Out here, I barely move the fly...they don't chase clams, so if you move it, you just pull it from the fish. I also trout set exclusively for the same reason. If I don't hook them the instant it is in their mouth, they eject and spook. Totally different other places I have fished...it all depends heavily on their main forage.

Other than the forage thing, the most important thing I learned with carp is to realize that you aren't fishing to "fish" but to a single individual fish. Even in a large group I find my success goes way way up when I take the time to identify ONE target, and then make decisions designed to help me catch that one fish. Get closer, change angles, drag and drop, strip or leave fly etc...when I make those calls on an individual fish basis I flat out catch more fish them when I make general decisions and simply fish. It is much more like hunting out here. Carp feed primarily by scent and taste, and since I don't chum nor use scented flies, I have to find actively feeding fish and figure out how to trigger a visual response to a fish that is often "grazing". Really fun and challenging fish! Good luck!

 

[Joni]

I agree if you can SEE the fish to target. Most times I cannot. I will see shadows occasionally, but the most part I target swirls and bubble and the nose that pops up here and there.

Lordy, if I could see the fish I would be in heaven..

And I do cast to clumps of fish so to speak. ;-)

 

[ditz]

I have just finished 3 partial days of throwing at carp with little success. I know that I did miss at least 2 or 3 takes out of my ignorance. I have never seen where anyone uses gurglers for carp. I am assuming you are tying them in smaller sizes. #6 to #10 maybe. ...... about the only thing that I did not try was some kind of indicator of which I did not have anything with me that would pass for such an animal. I will include an indicator of some sort in the future.

 

[enolaeagle]

I was checking out random carp flies last night. One site had a Yellow Glow Bug (turned) Nymph.. I thought it was pretty neat and basically the back end of a zugbug.
I decided to make one up with yellow dubbing because I don't have any glo-yarn.

 

[Joni]

Size 8. I like that foam with the shinny side too.
The Fly Tying Shop by TCO - Foam - LOCO FOAM - OIL.SLICK

Indicators I use small clear thingamabobs. They look like bubbles on the water and the carp keep hitting them. It's crazy!

 

[ditz]

Thank you Joni and John for your tips and others that have contributed. I now have some good reasons to sit at the vise.

I still think we need a forum for just carp.

 

[nick k]

I still think we need a forum for just carp.

That's a slippery slope.

 

[john montana]

I know some guys that fish for them with indicators in muddy water and it certainly is effective. I just love the sight fishing aspect of carp, so I seek them out in water that is clear enough to see them. When it is murky from feeding fish or just dirty water, I try to really move slow and zero in...you can usually see an outline or shape. I am certainly not against an indicator, I just enjoy targeting the fish without one more. The hunt is what gets me about carp...super addictive. One of the best things about carp is how adaptive they are, and the methods I have seen and used are ever evolving out there. I have caught them in 8 different states now and am still surprised by all the different ways they feed and eat flies. They are amazing creatures. It really comes down to the fish you chase. I say all the time that there is no one magic fly for all carp, but is probably one magic fly for your carp...they are just so varied in what they can use for a food source that a ton of methods can apply...just amazing fish!

For nymph/clam eaters, this is my go to fly, the hybrid:

I was shocked this year that the hybrid (small fly) actually worked on the goby eating carp of lake MI. From what I know of Great Lakes carp, they eat a ton of invasive gobies and crayfish...we go there every spring and fish two inch long bunny leeches that would scare carp on my home river the Columbia.

 

[Joni]

I love that fly! Does it come in yellow...just kidding

 

[dakotakid]

One of my goals for 2013 was to catch my first carp on a fly. Having just completed that goal this week, I'm certainly not an expert but will weigh in on what worked for me on my first and only attempt to date.

Was fishing a lake that was new to me, so started by trying to find some gills and LMB. Was on foot and working the shoreline. Heard some trashing and splashing some distance away at the shoreline and figured it's either LMB ambushing minnows or carp in the shallows. Either way, I was interested. Turns out it was carp and they seemed to be in spawn mode based on the fact that several were rolling over each other in the shallows.

Couple of local people were watching and told me spawning fish aren't interested in feeding. I generally agree with that, but also believe that not all fish of a specific species are in spawn mode at exactly the same time and some may not participate as eagerly as others (just my opinion). My target was those "other" carp that were swimming in close proximity. The water was not very clear, so I couldn't cast specifically to any one. I knew they were there because they were occasionally visible when they swirled the surface or when I accidentally spooked one.

Since I had a black over white MM Minnow fly on (from gill and bass fishing earlier), I made a couple of casts with that. In short order I had my first hit, which somehow spit the hook. Several casts later, the fight was on once again and I landed a nice carp just under 23 inches in length. GREAT fun on a 6 wt rod! Talk about rod bend the entire time. Needless to say, the locals that said the carp wouldn't bite were in disbelief and almost as excited as I was.



Several casts later, I had another carp that somehow spit the hook after a brief fight. I hooked four additional carp, but didn't land any of those. Either had poor hook sets or they spit my barbless fly. Needless to say, the locals that said the carp wouldn't bite were in disbelief and almost as excited as I was. They were also now providing lots of advise anytime one got away.

Thinking my fly with a #10 hook was too small, I tried flies with larger hooks without success. Didn't have an MM Minnow in the larger size so I tried gartside soft hackle streamer, wooly buggers, etc., without any hits. Switched back to the MM Minnow and had hits again. I'd show you a picture of it, but I lost the only two I tied while fishing for gills and bass yesterday evening. It was simply black marabou over white with silver bead chain using the pattern shown in http://ultralightflyfishing.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=94&t=6643.

Summary:
- I'm definitely hooked on carp fishing.
- Given the fact that carp spook so easily, fishing for them in cloudy water might actually be an advantage (assuming you have some indication they are present).
- Still not sure if I was losing fish because of poor hook-sets, too small a hook or because they were able to spit a barbless hook.

More research (fishing) is required.

 

[Joni]

Had to share this. A lean mean fly eating machine

And this is a sample of the water

 

[dakotakid]

Joni,

Since you have a lot of experience catching carp on flies, any thoughts on whether or not a #10 hook is too small? What size hook do you typically use?

Thanks.

 

[john montana]

It is all about the forage! My go to hook is a size 8 scorpion gaper, which is a carp bait hook equivalent to a size 10 tiemco scud hook. Unless the carp are predatory I think smaller is better for hook size.

You are right on with spawners. The actively spawning fish are not likely to eat, but the fish on the edges usually will. I did get this big lead female to eat a size 8 hybrids his year. She barely slowed down, just puffed her gills and inhaled the fly off the bottom as she swam by.

If you look behind me in the photo you can see hords of spawners. Check out this video:

https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=673372506022460&set=vb.189464864413229&type=3&theater

My preference is to find fish that are not spawning, but you can usually pick a few off of the edges. This big girl was taken on a 2 inch bunny leech...she broke out of a pack and chased the fly down like a bass. That would never happen here in OR! They are cool fish:

This is a home water fish I got in June. I did some filming with RA Beattie and stuck this one on a size 8 hybrid as well.

It has been a crazy year. I have landed 18 carp over 20 lbs this year, just one fish away from my record. Been a lot of fun seeing so many people get interested in these fish too...I was a total pariah 10 yers ago! Hah...